Amatoboxing (amatoboxingsite.multiply.com)


The Case for Benn, Collins, and Eubank in the Hall

benn boxing14.04.08 - By Ted Sares: The British press hates a winner who's British. They don't like any British man to have balls as big as a cow's like I have. -- Nigel Benn

I‘ll fight him [Roy Jones] in a phone box in front of two men and a dog. --Steve Collins

Not being born to parents who were accountants was probably my biggest mistake --Chris Eubank

When you think of these three guys, you sometimes think of words like peacock, controversy, arrogant and celebrity (particularly insofar as Chris Eubank was concerned). These were trademarks outside the ring, but in the ring, they provided uncommon excitement and entertainment..

Unfortunately, for two, Nigel Benn and Eubank, their career defining fights ended with tragic results and tend to detract from their entire body of work. As one writer stated, “One man’s finest hour was the end of another man’s life as he knew it." Let's look at that work now and see how their accomplishments stack up insofar as being prospective inductees into the International Boxing Hall of Fame.

Nigel Benn (1987-1996)

Benn conjures up words like fury, rage, and ferocity. These were his trademarks in the ring. Unfortunately, his career defining fight against Gerald McCllelan ended with tragic results.

Nigel "The Dark Destroyer" Benn, a Middleweight and Super Middleweight boxing Champion, 42 - 5 - 1 with 35 KO's (three of his defeats came at the end of his career), was born in Liford, England the son of Barbadian immigrants. As an amateur, he had a fine record of 41 wins and 1 loss. His pro KO percentage was an excellent 83%.

Ostensibly an orthodox fighter, he was a ballsy and brash bomber and is still considered to be one of the hardest punchers of all time, but when he fought at the top level, he sometimes and inexplicably became somewhat unglued. Still, the ferocity and velocity of his punches unmatched and were launched with evil intentions, the purest of rage, and often punctuated with a whirlwind of deadly hooks and uppercuts from all angles. With Nigel, the thing was his excitement and unpredictability. You knew what to expect...or maybe you didn’t.... which made him so exciting. He would come out bombing and winging and try to ice his opponents in short order usually knocking them out, but his "take no prisoner" strategy sometimes meant that he himself would be stopped. Some even called him one of boxing’s bad boys, and labeled his style as downright dirty. I refer to it as “win at all cost."

Nigel presented an unabashedly snarling mien and personified the aura of a person you would not want to meet in a dark alley. In short, he was one tough guy!

His quality of opposition was excellent. Aside from the hapless Winston Burnett (who would finish with 20-98-3), Benn fought boxers with mostly decent records in his early years, a departure from the norm. Guys like Reggie Miller, Abdul Umaru Sanda, Darren Hobson, Nicky Piper, Jamaican Anthony Logan, Kid Milo, Canadian Dan Sherry, Puerto Rican Jose Quinones, American Sanderline Williams, Congolese Mbayo Wa Mbayo, David Noel, and Argentinean Hector Lescano all came in with winning records.

He then stepped up to a higher level. He did battle with South African Thulani Malinga (twice), Italian and former WBC Super Middleweight champion Mauro Galvano (twice), former world champion Chris Eubank (twice), Juan Carlos Gimenez Ferreyra (46-6-3 coming in), Vincenzo Nardiello (26-3), tough Michael Watson (21-1-1 coming in) and, of course. World champion Steve Collins (twice). While the names here might not resonate as much with an average American boxing fan as they do with one in Europe or the UK, they should strike an intimate chord with all serious boxing fans regardless of location.


Steve Collins (1986-1997)

Among his early victims were Sam Storey (for the Irish Middleweight Title), rugged Tony Thorton and Kevin "Killer" Watts (for the USBA Middleweight Title.) He lost to Mike McCallum in 1990 for the WBA Middleweight Title in a close fight I attended. He then rebounded with 5 straight victories including wins over tough Eddie Hall and Dan Morgan. He dropped a razor thin and controversial MD to Reggie Johnson and a close UD to Sumbu Kalambay.

A discouraged Collins finally won the WBA Penta-Continental Middleweight Title in 1993 by KO win over South African Gerhard Botes. A year later he garnered the WBO Middleweight Title by a KO over the very capable Chris Pyatt in South Yorkshire, England. He would go on to win 15 straight to close out his career (the last 5 by stoppage). More importantly, during this streak, he fought and beat Chris Eubank and Nigel Benn twice. Benn, who had been though a grueling battle with Gerald McClellan, quickly got the message that his punching power was not good enough to stop concrete-chin Collins. Due to some brain scan issues, Steve found himself stepping into Ray Close’s shoes to meet Chris Eubank and he proceeded to beat the great English fighter twice. By the time he accomplished this remarkable feat, he was the reigning W.B.O. Middleweight champ, a fact still overlooked to the present day.

In all, he would successfully defend his new Super Middleweight title 8 times before retiring in1997 with a TKO win over Craig Cummings, 34-2, in 3 rounds. Curiously, he had begun his career in 1986 with a 3 round TKO over one Julio Mercado in Lowell, MA. Amazingly, he had book-ended his career with 16 in the beginning and 15 at the end with the TKO as icing on the cake. His final professional record was 36-3 with 21 KO‘s.

The quintessential professional, Steve was a road warrior having fought in Scotland, Ireland, Wales, England, Northern Ireland, France, Italy, Atlantic City, Las Vegas, the Meadowlands Arena in New Jersey and in and around the Boston area. More to the point, he was an extremely tough, seasoned, iron-chinned, determined and talented fighter who had long paid his dues training in the Boston area. He was considered to be one of the toughest pound-for-pound fighters of the late 90's having never been stopped in a high profile career.

Chris Eubank (1985-1998)

With one of the best physiques in boxing and arguably the best chin, he strutted like a peacock before each fight, but once the bell sounded, he was all business. He fought at five different weights on five different continents, and prior to losing his first bout, had a long and impressive unbeaten streak at 41-0-2..

“Simply the Best,” as he was known, finished with a slate of 45 (KO 23)-5 (KO 1)-2.

His level of competition was high from the start. In fact, he beat rugged Eric Holland in only his fourth bout. Having fought the likes of Renaldo Dos Santos, Nigel Benn (twice), Michael Watson (twice), Graciano Rocchigiani, Henry Wharton, Tony Thornton; Lindell Holmes, Dan Schommer (whose only career defeat was at the hands of Eubank) and Carl “The Cat” Thompson (twice), he fought simply the best.

Fighting from long range, he relied on awkward movement and superior reflexes, using quick sneaky shots and jarring uppercuts. Sometimes having stamina issues, he showed great heart at the end of his career, ironically winning over fans who would have nothing to do with his earlier arrogant persona.

But it was the second Watson fight that really did in Eubank, as he was never the same after that incredibly dramatic ending. Totally gassed, decked, reeling and ripe for the picking, he throws a vicious right uppercut from Hell that puts the gallant Watson down. never recovered in the break between rounds. That he was able to come out for the next (and final) round is a testament to his courage (or perhaps to the courage of his corner). At any rate, the results were tragic.

These fighters represented the cream of the crop during a great era of fighters in the UK, often fighting each other. Whether they get into the International Boxing Hall of Fame remains to be seen, but if the don’t, it will not be because of their lack of providing incredible excitement and indelible memories for boxing fans throughout the world. They will not soon be forgotten by boxing aficionados.

What do you think?

Courtesy of www.eastsideboxing.com


32 Comments
neverlast wrote on Apr 24
Ted...I feel that all three were solid champions and were a bit under rated here in the States. I have several of their fights on tape. I would not vote for them on the Hall Of Fame ballot. BUT...Since McGuigan is in the doors are wide open for these three.
tedsares wrote on Apr 24
And Norton, Ingo, Saad, Polamino etc. I say they belong, but I don't have a vote. Also, Little Red Lopez and a few Asian guys.
mrmonzon wrote on Apr 25
TED. Benn was a good fighter, but very dirty. gman had em out in one round, man no comment. good post.
neverlast wrote on Apr 25
Ted...I whole heartedly agree..." Little Red " should have been in a long time ago.
dmurphy wrote on Apr 25
Ted-
I don't think you mentioned it, or if you did then I'm sorry I just missed it, but I thought Nigel Benn's most impressive fight was one round demolition of Iran Barkely (if memory serves correctly,didn't he hit him while he was down on one of the KD's? As mrmonzon states, he was plenty dirty).

I don't think I'd vote for any of the three of them, as you point out their best and most memorable fights seem to be with each other, but I DO think they should be getting more consideration than they seem to be. IMO, Collins maybe has the best arguement, with the two wins over the others being the cornerstone for his case, but he's handicapped by the way his Career just kind of abruptly stopped. Had he been able to put a capper on it,then maybe he'd get more hype, I don't know. Do you remember when there was talk of a Roy Jones fight around 2000 or so, after Collins had been inactive for a couple years, but there just wasn't much interest in it. A great effort had he gotten that chance might've been what it took. There's definitely an American Bias with regard to the voting.
dmurphy wrote on Apr 25
I thought they were joking when I saw Ingo elected, I was amazed he was even on the Ballot much less voted in. Norton's the only "Heavyweight Champion" to go 0-3 in title fights, but let's face facts, and that's that he got in because he was 1-2 against Ali with the two losses disputed. A razor thin loss to Holmes and a couple other decent wins like against Young, and it at least makes some kind of case for overlooking the numerous blowout losses (Foreman,Shavers,Cooney). But does a 1-2 record against Floyd with both KO defeats warrant such consideration? You get beyond the Patterson fights and your looking at what exactly, a quick over Eddie Machen and a win over Henry Cooper and that's it???? You look at Ingo and you start making a VERY STRONG Case for Riddick Bowe lol.


dmurphy wrote on Apr 25
Ted...I whole heartedly agree..." Little Red " should have been in a long time ago.
Jim-
I know I've mentioned it to you before, but the years he's there, I get incredibly upset on HOF Sundays when I see Danny Lopez sitting off to the right of the Main Stage, where they have the dignitaries that are not HOF members. It's not made any easier when you see a McGuigan on the Main Stage. In fact, I'm hoping that Danny quits coming, I hate to see such a good man treated like horseshit. If they aren't going to put him in, then quit bringing him there. Sounds Cold, I know.
neverlast wrote on Apr 25
Dave ...I agree. You can only be snubbed so many times.
dmurphy wrote on Apr 26
Dave ...I agree. You can only be snubbed so many times.
Yeah, Danny is SUCH a nice guy, and I'm sure that's why they invite him and also why he can't tell them No when they ask, but at some point you have to draw the line. BTW, I don't know if you ever met Alli from our Site, but she's become friendly with Livingstone Bramble and he's CONVINCED that HE'S going to be going in next year when he's elgible. I think he's going to be disappointed and wonder how he's going to take it.
neverlast wrote on Apr 26
Bramble was a tough guy who stopped Youngstown, Ohio hero Ray " Boom Boom " Mancini to win the title. I believe he halted another good fighter in a defense named Tyrone Crawley. I'll have to look that up. I felt Mancini won the rematch with Bramble but it was close enough that I couldn't say Ray was robbed. Bramble later lost his title when HOFer Edwin Rosario blew him out in two rounds. After that Bramble had a kind of checkered career against good competition. I would NEVER vote for Bramble to be inducted. As much as I like Ray Mancini, I would not vote for him either. I think you're right Dave. Bramble might be awfully disappointed. Hey he just might get in. With the HOF these days you just never know.
dmurphy wrote on Apr 27
Jim-
You can hardly blame Bramble for thinking that, can you? I mean, he watches Barry McGuigan go in and has to think that if goes, I go, right? When the Bar gets lowered to that point, then we see what kind of Pandrora's Box gets opened. It's just an amazing process in which you can point to lowered standards on one hand and then at the same time talk about deserving candidates that have been denied. With Baseball at least it's all about the Denied, other than Joe Tinker (who got in for being part of a poem) I can't think of any McGuigans, Nortons,Johanssens,etc. in Cooperstown.
tedsares wrote on Apr 27
Yes, technically, he should have been disqualified. Benn did whatever it took to win.
tedsares wrote on Apr 27
"And Norton, Ingo, Saad, Polamino etc. I say they belong, but I don't have a vote. Also, Little Red Lopez and a few Asian guys" What I meant to say is that I don't think Norton, Ingo, Saad, Polamino etc belong.
neverlast wrote on Apr 27
Ted S. Is one of your Asian candidates Yoko Gushiken ? Just curious. Masao Ohba of Japan looked to be on his way to a HOF career but sadly as in the case of Salvador Sanchez they left this world much too early. We'll never know how great these two could have been. Sad, very sad indeed.
dmurphy wrote on Apr 28, edited on Apr 28
"And Norton, Ingo, Saad, Polamino etc. I say they belong, but I don't have a vote. Also, Little Red Lopez and a few Asian guys" What I meant to say is that I don't think Norton, Ingo, Saad, Polamino etc belong.
Ted-
I read it the way you intended it and didn't notice.......it's funny how I've never met anyone that actually voted for Norton and Ingo, but yet somebody must have because they're in. Just curious, but are the vote totals available, I've never seen them anywhere. The IBHOF tends to do things out of popularity and with the intention of a good turnout in June........or perhaps in some cases,another agenda that I hate to speculate on. The number of peripheral characters in the place FAR outnumbers the actual Boxers, including some scoundrels, most noteably last years Sulamin induction which pleased only Chuck Williams and I'm sure wasn't done with some behind the scenes motivation.
tedsares wrote on May 2
Absolutley. And Ohba as well.
tedsares wrote on May 2
Also, some Korean guys belong in there as well. Asians have been stiffed big time.
neverlast wrote on May 2, edited on May 2
Ted my friend you got me thinking so I did a little checking. I went to the IBHOF website and checked out the Inductees. VERY interesting...In the Modern section the Orient is represented by three fighters. All of course very worthy. They are Flash Elorde from the Philippines, Fighting Harada from Japan and Khaosai Galaxy of Thailand. That's it. Well being from Ohio I am proud to say that we have four Modern inductees. They also are very deserving. They are Jimmy Bivins, Ezzard Charles, Joey Maxim and Aaron Pryor. Ohio beats the Orient 4 to 3. Say what ???In the Old Timers section the Orient is represented by the great Pancho Villa of the Philippines. Ohio has Johnny Kilbane and Freddy Miller.

Like Ted has pointed out, there is something very wrong with this picture.
neverlast wrote on May 2
Ted or anyone...Please throw out some names of Orient fighters who you think should be considered for IBHOF status. Years ago I used to get an Orient boxing magazine from the astute IBHOF writer Joe Koizumi of Japan. I wish I could find them. I'm sure I have them packed away somewhere. Anyway some names that quickly came to my mind were Yoko Gushiken and Koichi Wajima of Japan. Pone Kingpetch, Chartchai Chionoi and Venice Borkorsor of Thailand.
dmurphy wrote on May 3
Ted my friend you got me thinking so I did a little checking. I went to the IBHOF website and checked out the Inductees. VERY interesting...In the Modern section the Orient is represented by three fighters. All of course very worthy. They are Flash Elorde from the Philippines, Fighting Harada from Japan and Khaosai Galaxy of Thailand. That's it. Well being from Ohio I am proud to say that we have four Modern inductees. They also are very deserving. They are Jimmy Bivins, Ezzard Charles, Joey Maxim and Aaron Pryor. Ohio beats the Orient 4 to 3. Say what ???In the Old Timers section the Orient is represented by the great Pancho Villa of the Philippines. Ohio has Johnny Kilbane and Freddy Miller.

Like Ted has pointed out, there is something very wrong with this picture.
Jim-
I remember it took an effort of some voters who noticed the ommission to get Galaxy elected his Second Year Elgible. Disappointly enough, some of them were totally in the dark on Khaosai.
tedsares wrote on May 3
Ah so!
bizzack wrote on May 5, edited on May 5
Was Collins "GREAT"? NO! Was he "FAMOUS"? Only in Ireland!

NO GO FOR STEVIE!

*BB*

As for the other two, let me think about it, but they are at best VERY 'borderline'.

As for what Jones would have done to Collins in his prime? Pfft...wouldn't have even been close. Jones by mid/late TKO. Jones-Benn? Would have been "fun while it lasted", but Jones by early KO over the wide-open-as-a-whales-vagina Benn. Jones-Eubank? Jones by relatively easy decision, with Eubank perhaps winning 3 or 4 rounds.

"That's just my humble opinion folks."
bizzack wrote on May 5
* The guy in the 90's at 160-168 that probably had the best chance of beating Roy?

Sadly...Gerald McClellan.

( I would have only made Roy a slight favorite in that one.)

*BB*
tedsares wrote on May 5
HHhhmmmmmm......._____________________________
neverlast wrote on May 5
Gerald was a very talented fighter who was struck by tragedy as was another somewhat forgotten fighter of that era, Michael Watson.
tedsares wrote on May 5
Gerald and Chris were never the same
neverlast wrote on May 5
I have a tape ( poor quality ) of Roberto Duran visiting England and training there. He sparred with an up and coming Nigel Benn. Roberto was in a playful mood and he let Benn cuff him around a bit. When there were times that Roberto got serious he toyed with Benn. Like Biz said, Benn was as wide open as a whale's vagina.Damn Biz no matter how bad a day I've had I can always get on here and read your posts. I get quite the chuckle.
bizzack wrote on May 5
I've got to give it to you though 'Bull' -- you ask some real 'humdingers' in this ongoing series. Guys who are admittedly very questionable and 'borderline'...but guys who you could arguably make a case pro or con.

Watson...he was probably a half-notch below the group, but a good fighter nevertheless. He has at least made a partial (and significant) recovery, whereas McClellan...no other way to put it really...is almost basically a 'vegetable'.
bizzack wrote on May 5
BTW - Great quotes Ted...(!)

;-)
bizzack wrote on May 5
One of things that makes these cases a bit complicated...is that I agree: These guys were all a bit underrated here in The States.

Benn? He has the victories over both McClellan and Barkely. ( Barkely was HORRIBLY weight-drained for that fight and completely dead by the time the bell rang -- but nevertheless: It "was what it was".)

Eubank? A very good fighter, and given he had really no business whatsoever fighting above 175 -- his win over the very tough Thompson at cruiser was a hell of an accomplishment.

Collins? Well, to complicate things further -- he owns wins over the two.

Damn...you couldn't get more 'borderline' maybe so/maybe not choices if you tried Ted...(!)

* I'm going to have to say that all three just fall barely short though. While they were all good - and fairly popular - I can't call any of them "GREAT" -- nor can I really call any of them (worldwide) "FAMOUS" either for that matter!
bizzack wrote on May 5
BTW - Of course we can say "what about Mcguigan" and "what about Norton" -- but if we do that, we'll be here all night (or all year?) nominating fighters.
dmurphy wrote on May 6
bizzack said
BTW - Of course we can say "what about Mcguigan" and "what about Norton" -- but if we do that, we'll be here all night (or all year?) nominating fighters.
Bizz-
Yeah, with the IBHOF we really have to move beyond the past discretions or we'll never finish the list :) I think the thing I like about the articles that both Ted and Jim write is not that the guys neccesarly deserve to be in the Hall, but that they're at least getting some focus on their case. I don't think anyone is even speaking up for them,
Add a Comment
   
Amatoboxing
Join this Group!RSS FeedHelp on RSS FeedsAdd to My Yahoo
Report Abuse
© 2008 Multiply, Inc.    About · Blog · Terms · Privacy · Corp Info · Contact Us · Help